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Is TFM in a vicious cycle of degeneration?

Topic started by rajaG (@ 208.24.179.211) on Tue Sep 26 15:43:14 EDT 2000.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.

I have checked the archives and for some reason a topic with a similar heading is gone!
So here's is some food for thought.

1. Actors like Ajith, Vijay, etc commanding MDs to copy from "English CDs" and set them to Indian lyrics.
2. MDs like Deva, Sirpi copying left, right and center, in situations excluding item 1 above.
3. Bad pronunciation of singers.
4. MDs like SAR repeating the same tune over and over and over......you get the point (and many times in the same film)
5. ARR not putting any effort in re-recording at all- merely playing the songs in the movie with slower/faster versions.
6. ARR, Srikanth (Deva's son), etc blatantly indulging in lip-synch activities. Other lesser known artists, engaged in karaoke singing. While this does not directly affect TFM it speaks for the lack of confidence in the talents of the artists.
7. Many occurences of really stupid lyrics - though most of them may be blamed on the director/producers adamant insistence or same boring situations.
8. Absence of thespians who could inspire Kannadasan, TMS, SPB, PS etc to give their best.

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Responses:

• Old responses
  
• From: rajaG (@ 207.43.195.203) on: Thu Mar 6 12:05:08 EST 2003
  
  st: This Sam is the 'good one' and is a musician from UK (Sam - please correct me if I am wrong).
  
  Sam - Excellent observations. Unfortunately, this is the reality. ARR does a Kaadhal Sadugudu (with excellent harmony and slap bass) and a SnEgidhanE (beuatiful punch in of vocal chorus with the melody). Now starts the trend - the next MD doesn't have the time/motivation/talent to get inspired to challenge himself to come up with an equally wonderful number. So what does he do? He imitates a part of what of ARR included which had nothing to do with the beauty of ARR's song. He explains all the success to SS's faulty pronunciation or a bad vocal chorus or unbearable vocals (read YSR here) and forces multiple songs on us. Before long, we have too many Udits, SS, purposeless strings of English words, gimmicky sounds crowding the plate - all that creativity in the slap bass, strings arrangement, vocal harmony conviniently forgotten because it is too much effort. That is unfortunately the degeneration.
  
  
  
  
  
• From: Thiru (@ 168.166.80.205) on: Thu Mar 6 12:58:36 EST 2003
  
  exactly rajaG...ARR produced a great song 'Kannalane' which was horribly immitated by S.A. Rajkumar as 'Sollamale yaar paarthadhu'... and S.A.R went on to say on the record that his song was better than 'kannalane'....just like the great anand milind saying 'tu tu tu tu tu tara' tune was their own creation...:)
  
  
• From: vijay (@ 68.16.25.50) on: Thu Mar 6 13:07:55 EST 2003
  
  Sam, my problem is not with the lack of proper usage of instruments or slap bass etc. but the absence of strong tunes that were present in plenty during 70s/80s. Most of the melodies seem painfully contrived, slow paced(just to contrast with the fast paced songs in the album and make sure the listener notices it as a "melody") and lack the natural flow in them.None of the new songs that you mentioned fall into my category of strong, appealing tunes. Even the current topmost MD has ways to go with regard to this.
  
  And even in slightly faster paced melodies like "kala kala vena pozhiyum megam" (Rhythm) or "Thaniye thannanthaniye" (Rhythm), "Kannodu kaanbathellam" the emphasis seems to be more on the catchy sandhams and rhythm than on any intricate melody lines. Listen to "Vaa Ponmayile" (Poonthalir) or "Idhazhil Kathi ezhuthum" or "idhu kuzhandhai paadum" (Oru thalai raagam) and notice the melody flow. Maybe I am being a little subjective here. But since I believe you have started listening to TFM fairly recently (especially the older songs)and hence not as opinionated as the rest of us :-), I wanted to get an unbiased view from you.
  
  
• From: kiru (@ 192.138.150.249) on: Thu Mar 6 14:04:02 EST 2003
  
  After having been exposed to strings and wcm style orchestration fused with indian classical/traditional melodies for almost half a century, tamil and the indian film music industry, embraced ARR with open arms, for his fresh new presentation. After ten years of his entry, the industry has seen an infusion of so-called 'new talent' but none IMHO, that can challenge the masters of yore. ARR, in the last few years, understands the responsibility on his shoulders and seems to be doing much more 'intellectual' music. Sadly, these compositions are ignored and his mediocre stuff propped up by the 'consumer with buying power' and the media. Is this the limitation of the new 'style/format' of the music or has degeneration set in like the way rajaG has explained ?
  Personally, I would like to see better tamil pronouncition, less volume levels for percussion in the mix and more mature lyrics. Even though, to some extent I share vijay's opinions on the quality of tunes, this is something too subjective, the only thing I can say is, lets avoid too many chorus stuff, make these people sing harmony in the bg, thats okay with me.
  
  
• From: tigger (@ 205.219.204.23) on: Thu Mar 6 15:05:40 EST 2003
  
  ...
  I am not calling for a complaint attitude or askin ourselves to submit to whatever is offered, but rather protesting the snobbish disposition of praising the Past at the expense of Present........ and vice-versa.
  
  When somebody appreciates the inclusion of 3/4 beat in a 4/4 time in Yen Iniya Pon Nilave (please excuse my tamil, I donno tamil, I am telugu) what obstructs him from atleast acknowledging (forget appreciation) the presence of the same in No Problem (Love Birds)?
  ....
  
  Sam,
  
  I haven't read the whole of this thread, so sorry if I am off-base here.
  
  I did want to reply to the point you mentioned though. There are people like you who can appreciate the technical aspects of a song, and there are people like me who are just fans of music, but have no clue as to the technical aspects BUT
  
  let me use figure skating as an analogy here. You are saying that when x does a triple jump and spin (dont know the technical name for it), why does he not get the same appreciation that y got when he made the exact same triple jump and spin. My thinking on it would be that it is because technical difficulty is just one aspect of it. Points are also awarded for overall presentation, flow, the way that particular jump ties in with the rest of the presentation etc.
  
  
  
• From: mythila (@ 137.237.13.20) on: Thu Mar 6 16:33:34 EST 2003
  
  Jency had vocal limitation too. She's basically a good midrange singer. Her songs like Idayam pogude, Ayiram malargale malarungal , Deiveega raagam , adi penne were good. But I feel she messed up Envaanile from Johnny(esp the end of Charanam ending with a kaarvai, her voice breaks?)
  IR is indifferent in the rendition(presentation) of his composition , where today's MDs score.
  
  
• From: Sam (@ 132.235.228.171) on: Sat Mar 8 20:35:07 EST 2003
  
  Raja G, I am from Visakhapatnam, AP rite now in Athens Ohio for my studies. Thanks for ur encouragement.
  
  Trigger, I didnt excatly get what u wanted to say. Neways if u meant to say that 3/4 in No Problem didnt fit with the overall flow, that is fine. For some people, inclusion of such a thing might fit into their scheme of things, and hence appreciate it, and for some it might be an abberation, it depends on their inclinations and tastes. But for both the categories, the fact is 'such a thing is present". That is the reason I have said "atleast acknowledging it, forget appreciation". I think, we want to be blind (or deaf) on some occasions.
  
  (On a side note, appreciation is very mcuh a subjective reaction, depends on the person ( person implies both the listener and the composer). U like a composer u tend to like his music. When we listen to (new) piece of music, esp in wcm, it is said to know who the composer is, his time period, the kind of music it is, sometimes the characteristic traits of the composer and other such details. These help in the appreciation of the music and in turn the composer.)
  
  
• From: Sam (@ 132.235.228.171) on: Sat Mar 8 20:42:51 EST 2003
  
  Trigger, no offence meant at all. If my post seems rude, please excuse me. I very much respect ur tastes.
  
  
• From: tigger (@ 64.108.203.198) on: Sun Mar 9 16:31:26 EST 2003
  
  test
  
  
• From: tigger (@ 64.108.203.198) on: Sun Mar 9 16:39:56 EST 2003
  
  ...Trigger, I didnt excatly get what u wanted to say. Neways if u meant to say that 3/4 in No Problem didnt fit with the overall flow, that is fine...
  
  ...That is the reason I have said "atleast acknowledging it, forget appreciation"...
  
  I was not making a comment on that particular song, just the point that a technical feature used in 2 songs does not mean both songs are equally good.
  
  I guess your second point was addressed to the experts, and I would have no idea about this (whether they did or did not acknowledge it).
  
  ...If my post seems rude, please excuse me...
  open yr eyes and read the moronic postings in all the other threads. U must be a saint if u consider yr post rude! :)
  
  

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